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    Havin some fun with Snow

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    Roxie
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    Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Roxie on Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:31 pm

    Ok, this is my first RMT, so Imma cross my fingers on this. As the name implies, I made this team to deal with hail.

    The hail storm

    Now, to start off my hail team, I have, none other than: Abomasnow!
    Abomasnow (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Grass Knot
    - Synthesis
    - Focus Blast
    - Ice Beam
    Considering that this is a special set, that's exactly what I wanted. Basically, it's to start out the hailstorm, and if need be, take out any water/fighting/flying types that send out some nasty threats. Basically any other roles for it would be to cancel out any other weathers like Sun/Rain/Sandstorm.

    Next off, is my "Wall"rein (cheap joke, shh).
    Walrein (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Ice Body
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Ice Beam
    - Frost Breath
    - Hidden Power [Psychic]
    - Surf
    It's not really a wall, but more of a neutralizer. The Hidden Power Psychic is for any fighting types that would hurt it. Course, it's not really that fast so...oh well. I don't really know the role for Walrein, besides the fact that it has some good defense.

    Most people think that I make my Hail team all Ice, and they would be wrong, for here, is Alakazam!
    Alakazam (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Psyshock
    - Shadow Ball
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Focus Blast
    My Zam is to take out the steel types and other walls like Blissey, Chansey, etcetera. Shadow Ball is for the other Psychis and Ghosts out there. Anything else about Zam would be for to troll any toxic users, other hail users, or sandstorm users.

    Time for my Graceful Kat, Glaceon.
    Glaceon (F) @ Ice Gem
    Trait: Ice Body
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Toxic
    - Ice Beam
    - Shadow Ball
    - Ice Shard
    Shadow Ball is for the psychics and ghosts, like my Zam. Toxic is for a slow killer. Ice Beam is for the flying types (naturally). Ice Shard for priorty. This was basically for a filler pokemon, it's not that really good for a hail team, but I thought I might as well use her.

    My true Queen of the Ice, Frosslass!
    Froslass (F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Snow Cloak
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Psychic
    - Blizzard
    - Ice Beam
    - Shadow Ball
    Giving it a Scarf and speed makes this thing a hard hitter, and a very effective evader. Blizzard is for the excellent Accuracy in the hail. Might as well say it, Frosslass is basically a back-up sweeper, if Cloyster gets defeated (which 9/10 it will). The evasion it has, plus the special attack makes it a pretty good sweeper, if I may say so myself.

    My ultimate sweeper, Cloyster!
    Cloyster (M) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Skill Link
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Icicle Spear
    - Rock Blast
    - Shell Smash
    - Ice Shard
    This is basically self explanatory. The best sweeper I have on my team. Of course, Spikes and Stealth Rock kills the focus sash effect. Other than that, it works very well.

    I realise that I do not have any supports set up, so I am welcome to any suggestions about that.

    Well, that's my first RMT, hope ya liked it, and I'm very welcome to any suggestions. Sorry that I can't get any sprites on.


    Last edited by [SH]Chaos Wolf on Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:05 pm; edited 1 time in total


    __________________
    GerudoDesert
    quickest battle ever:

    Start of turn 1
    Gardevoir has Mega Evolved into Mega Gardevoir!
    Gardevoir used Focus Blast!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 fainted!

    蓝色闪光: ⊙▽⊙
    Shadow Roxas: Noooot this time buddy
    蓝色闪光 forfeited against Shadow Roxas!

    The window was disabled due to one of the players closing the battle window.
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    harsha
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Sun Nov 27, 2011 5:36 pm

    Placeholder for your rate. I'll go ahead and say that I don't have many structural changes to implement, but I'd like to help your movesets. Also, Ice is an awful typing. That being said, you may want to replace 1 or 2 of your Pokemon. Glaceon seems weak because it has a ton of weaknesses and is very slow. I'll help you out when I finish Rick's rate.
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    PkmnTrainer Shane

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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by PkmnTrainer Shane on Sun Nov 27, 2011 9:06 pm

    Place holder. I need some time to think about this weather team.
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:47 pm

    Alright, let's get down to business (reference, anyone?). Hail is a cool and underused weather; that being said, Hail is probably the weakest weather out there, though I've seen some good teams such as Rick's. I'll try and rate this to the best of my ability.

    Abomasnow: It seems that Abomasnow has no specific role for this team other than setting up your weather. With that in mind, I suggest you try out a Scarf or a SubSeed set.

    Abomasnow @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Snow Warning
    EVs: 252 SAtk | 4 SDef | 252 Spe
    Modest | Timid Nature
    ~Blizzard
    ~Giga Drain | Other Grass move that is Special and deals decent damage
    ~Focus Blast
    ~A Hidden Power of your choice


    Keep in mind that I left so many options open because I do not play Hail.

    Walrein: All Walreins must be StallReins. Period. Here:

    Walrein @ Leftovers
    Trait: Ice Body
    EVs: 232 HP | 252 Def | 24 SDef
    Bold Nature
    ~Protect
    ~Substitute
    ~Blizzard | Surf
    ~Roar


    Basically use this like Whimsicott. Take a hit, Substitute, and then Toxic. Now you keep using a combo of Sub and Protect to stall the opponent out.

    Cloyster: You need more coverage, and two Ice moves will not grant you that. Use Razor Shell over either Ice Shard or Icicle Spear. I recommend using it over Ice Shard, but it's your choice.

    Now, I don't think the rest of the team fits because you have too many Ice types. I'll recommend Trick Room Reuniclus over Alakazam because it is a better staller (what Hail is made for), and because it has the same Special Attack and shares Magic Guard. I would look up a Spiker Frolass on Smogon, if I were you, because it provides some Hazards that will be helpful, and because Frolass already has good Speed and does not need a Scarf. Glaceon is not my favorite because it is so slow. Honestly, I'd replace it with a faster Pokemon. Maybe try out a Blizzard | Draco Meteor | Hidden Power [Electric] | Focus Blast Kyurem. He's good under Hail, and I think he'd benefit your team. Good luck, and I hope this helped.




    Last edited by Harsha on Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:08 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : Fixing up some grammar.)
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Roxie on Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:41 pm

    Thanks Harsha, I tried the sets above and they worked really well for my hail team. I like the Froslass set, and it was really excellent. Maybe next time I see ya on a server we can test it and see how ya think I use it. It worked pretty good when I tried it for an ice gym. Not really sure on how it went, I'll get the response later. Off topic, what happended to Minccino's Mansion? Thanks for the rate.


    __________________
    GerudoDesert
    quickest battle ever:

    Start of turn 1
    Gardevoir has Mega Evolved into Mega Gardevoir!
    Gardevoir used Focus Blast!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 fainted!

    蓝色闪光: ⊙▽⊙
    Shadow Roxas: Noooot this time buddy
    蓝色闪光 forfeited against Shadow Roxas!

    The window was disabled due to one of the players closing the battle window.
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    harsha
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:07 pm

    Any time. I'm up for a battle if I see you. Also, I'm not sure where Minccino's Mansion went, but I'll see what I can find.

    EDIT: Minccino's Mansion is back up.
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    PkmnTrainer Shane

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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by PkmnTrainer Shane on Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:18 am

    *FacePalm* Okay..if it's a rate you want then no.I may rate it later though. I can understand why you would delete posts that have NOTHING to do with the post, but mine was related to it. This post will be shortly deleted anyway...so if you have a grugde...just forget about it...
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:41 pm

    Shane, I think your post was deleted because you stated that he needed 6 EVs in one stat, which is completely incorrect. That's probably the reason.
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by PkmnTrainer Shane on Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:55 pm

    Using 6 evs is the same as using 4...
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:50 pm

    Exactly. You said that you recommend he change his set to incorporate 6 EVs. However, that isn't a viable recommendation seeing as he already had a 252 / 4 / 252 set. There was nothing added to help rate his team, so I think that's why your post got deleted. By the way, Roxas, I forgot to read the items on your sets. I think that using Leftovers on your Cloyster would benefit you more, as most players use Hazards and almost everyone has a priority move at bay. Just a suggestion.
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Trinitrotoluene on Sat Dec 03, 2011 3:38 am

    I'll delete posts when they're irrelevant to a discussion going on in a thread. For example, "..........." doesn't contribute to the improvement of this team. It's only there to postcount++. Now, if you had marked it off as a placeholder, that would be a different story. Also Shane, read this before recommending EV spread changes. It's very heavy on rudimentary mathematics, but it's a must-read if you want to make EV spreads that are tailored for specific reasons.
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Kira Light on Sat Dec 17, 2011 9:04 pm

    I suggest Blizzard instead of Ice Beam for Glaceon, since you are in Hail after all. Also, you should replace Ice Shard, since Glaceon's base attack is quite underwhelming. I suggest Hidden Power [Fighting] to deal with Steel types more effectively.


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    Roxie
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Roxie on Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:51 am

    Welll, I was really lookin forward to Rick's post, but Harsha's works just as well. But umm...Harsha, on Reu and Ky, can you be a tad bit more specific? I had a hard time re-making this team yesterday.


    __________________
    GerudoDesert
    quickest battle ever:

    Start of turn 1
    Gardevoir has Mega Evolved into Mega Gardevoir!
    Gardevoir used Focus Blast!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 fainted!

    蓝色闪光: ⊙▽⊙
    Shadow Roxas: Noooot this time buddy
    蓝色闪光 forfeited against Shadow Roxas!

    The window was disabled due to one of the players closing the battle window.
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    harsha
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Sun Dec 18, 2011 1:11 pm

    Alrighty; I'll give you some sets then.

    Reuniclus @ Life Orb
    Trait: Magic Guard
    EVs: 252 HP | 4 Def | 252 SAtk
    IVs: 0 Spe
    Modest Nature | Quiet Nature
    ~Trick Room
    ~Recover | Shadow Ball
    ~Psyshock | Psychic
    ~Focus Blast


    I'll add a few more sets when I get back from the Texans game.
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Kira Light on Sun Dec 18, 2011 1:17 pm

    I see a glaring weakness to Swords Dance Lucario, who can sweep your team. I suggest using Slowbro over Froslass.



    Slowbro @ Leftovers
    Ability: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (-Atk, +Def)
    ~ Slack Off
    ~ Scald
    ~ Thunder Wave
    ~ Flamethrower

    Slowbro can take hits all day, and regain 33% of his health by switching out.
    By the way, Texans are going to win the Super Bowl and destroy the Panthers today.
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Roxie on Sun Dec 18, 2011 1:18 pm

    funny how I used exactly that set (Shadow/Shock set) and EVs.
    Also, Ive never been good with slowbro, but I'll consider it.


    Last edited by [SH]Chaos Wolf on Sun Dec 18, 2011 1:22 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : Adding so no duo post.)


    __________________
    GerudoDesert
    quickest battle ever:

    Start of turn 1
    Gardevoir has Mega Evolved into Mega Gardevoir!
    Gardevoir used Focus Blast!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 fainted!

    蓝色闪光: ⊙▽⊙
    Shadow Roxas: Noooot this time buddy
    蓝色闪光 forfeited against Shadow Roxas!

    The window was disabled due to one of the players closing the battle window.
    avatar
    Trinitrotoluene
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Trinitrotoluene on Sun Dec 18, 2011 3:28 pm

    Alright. I deleted my old post, seeing that it fell under the definition of postcount++. So, here's my rate.

    While Hail is a fun weather to try out, making nearly every member in it an Ice-type is the first step to losing the match. This makes your team insanely vulnerable to Scizor, Heatran, Tyranitar, Terrakion, Jirachi, Lucario, Conkeldurr, and Volcarona, just to name a few threats. These cannot be dealt with if you keep the paradigm of "They must be immune to hail if it's to be a hail team" in your head. To deal with the aforementioned threats, I'd consider implementing a Heatran of your own, holding an Air Balloon, which can deal with 4 of the threats listed here (Scizor, Heatran, Jirachi, Volcarona). To deal with the other threats, I'd recommend a bulky Fighter, along the lines of Machamp and Conkeldurr. Alternatively, should you wish to go the other route and be more defensive, Slowbro is fantastic for its ability to take hits and threaten with Psychic. Of course, it all comes down to preference. Overall though, this team has some kinks to work out before it can really soar.

    Now, onto my nitpicks.

    Abomasnow: I'd remove Synthesis, seeing that Hail is antagonistic toward the effects of Synthesis, and try out either a Scarfed set or a more defensive SubSeed set.

    Walrein: Stallrein, as seen in the link provided, or bust. It's Walrein's ONLY viable set in OU, and it can help when dealing with many of the aforementioned threats. Also, if you were to recommend the placement of one of the recommended Pokemon in this team, I'd recommend it be placed over here or over Froslass.

    Alakazam: I see nothing wrong with it, but I'd recommend Focus Sash over Life Orb, so Scizor doesn't go too far against your team.

    Glaceon: I'd recommend Kyurem over Glaceon here, because of the former's better bulk and Speed. It's just a matter of being outclassed.

    Froslass: In my opinion, Froslass is unneeded in this team. Sure evasion abuse is fun, but it leaves you especially vulnerable to Scizor. However, should you choose to keep it, I'd recommend making it a support variant that lays Spikes down. The Spikes damage will make it harder for your opponent to switch Pokemon around. Alternatively, you could keep Walrein and implement one of the suggested Pokemon here.

    Cloyster: Perfectly fine. Just watch out for Scizor and the rare Scarfed Latios.
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    Roxie
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by Roxie on Sun Dec 18, 2011 4:05 pm

    Hmm, I need to edit my team then (will test later tonight [around 10 PM EastCoast] if able to).


    __________________
    GerudoDesert
    quickest battle ever:

    Start of turn 1
    Gardevoir has Mega Evolved into Mega Gardevoir!
    Gardevoir used Focus Blast!
    It's super effective!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's 劈斩司令 fainted!

    蓝色闪光: ⊙▽⊙
    Shadow Roxas: Noooot this time buddy
    蓝色闪光 forfeited against Shadow Roxas!

    The window was disabled due to one of the players closing the battle window.
    avatar
    harsha
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    Re: Havin some fun with Snow

    Post by harsha on Wed Dec 21, 2011 9:12 pm

    Well, after seeing Delko's work, I decided to show you his Hail RMT from Smogon. Keep in mind that I'm not insisting you copy his team; rather, I want to show you an impressive Hail team that deals with many of the teams in OU and holds up against other weather teams. The team can be seen here. After looking at Rick's rate and this team, it has become apparent that many of the good Hail teams in existence use Heatran; Heatran is able to check all of Hail's many counters. Also, you'll benefit from a Spinner, so may I suggest either Forretress, Tentacruel, or even Donphan? I know that this rate is coming in late, but I guess I wanted to revive this thread. So... Good luck!

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